Race Hub tonight............

I think Gibson could be a good Car chief. But he doesnt belong on the box. Leave his #### at the shop.
& yes SS14, he is as horrible as I make him out to be. Might be one of the worst CC's of all time.
As an owner you want your driver to get along with the CC. It is the owners job to hire & fire & make necessary changes. Saying it is Ryans job or even fault that they havent made a CC change just shows how little ownership is paying attention or doing to make this team better. You either change the CC, Driver or both! Jeff Gordon didnt want to change Letarte, but Mr. H. did it anyways. You know why. He cares for all his teams. Dale Jr. didnt want to change his CC, they did it anyways. All teams are better for it.

To call him one of the worst ccs of all time is a joke and an exaggeration. I am not saying he is even that good. But come on.

Stop blaming the ownership. It gets old. It seems like when Ryan has a bad week people blame Gibson and the ownership for not doing a good job of firing Gibson. The ownership is just fine. Tony Stewart knows what he is doing, Gene Haas knows what he is doing. If it was so bad then Ryan would have tried to leave a while ago.

Fatback McSwain and Bobby Labonte didn't get along to well. A shame too. After the split Bobby stopped winning and hasn't won since...

Gibson isn't as bad as most make him out to be. But at the same token, he needs to go or go home. But if Ryan likes him and thinks that he isn't the problem then constantly bashing him does nothing. I've said it and I will say it again. It is up to Newman if Gibson will be gone. Could be a moot point as he might be elsewhere next year.

You are so right.

MW, I think Bootie Barker was at SHR just before Tony and Ryan started. Not sure???

Bootie was a long timer at Haas. But he perhaps joked his way out of be apart of the team (made a lot of jokes at Tony's expense). When Tony cleaned house when he came over, he was one of the first to go. Barker is a smart guy and a good crew chief. But he is where he is supposed to be.

you think gibson was responsible for the win at martinsville?? the thing is with you tony fans, you all think its a dig at tony for the things said, its not, how often do you listen to the radio of the 39? i can remember last year when tony was sucking in the first 26 races you were quick to criticize DG, so why cant we do the same???

Ryan's win at Martinsville was pure luck, nothing to do with Gibson.

I and nobody ever said that Grubb was one of the worst ccs in the history of cup. I did however note how inconsistent they were and that something was missing. Clearly management saw that too and a change was made.

SHR feels that perhaps the issues with the 39 are not limited to Gibson I guess. I just feel it is easier to judge someone who out there working their #### off while we sit and watch them. Schmoopy mentioned Gordon. Gordon had Letarte for five seasons and part of 2005. This is Newman's fourth season with Gibson.

Venting about Gibson is healthy. But blaming everything on him is not. It's unfair and unrealistic.

Ryan's win at Martinsville was pure luck, nothing to do with Gibson.

I and nobody ever said that Grubb was one of the worst ccs in the history of cup. I did however note how inconsistent they were and that something was missing. Clearly management saw that too and a change was made.

SHR feels that perhaps the issues with the 39 are not limited to Gibson I guess. I just feel it is easier to judge someone who out there working their #### off while we sit and watch them. Schmoopy mentioned Gordon. Gordon had Letarte for five seasons and part of 2005. This is Newman's fourth season with Gibson.

Venting about Gibson is healthy. But blaming everything on him is not. It's unfair and unrealistic.

I only blame two things on him. Poor decision making on the box, & an incapability to think for himself on the box. (which could come from lack of confidence)
Put him in the shop & obviously he understands the in & outs of a car. They often times come to the track with a fast car, until the 1st pit stop. That is why I say he might be an awesome car chief. Who knows.
You guys complained about DG, meanwhile Tony had some of the best cars on the track & was in contention more often than not for wins & leads.
Ryan's team is very consistent. We know what to expect from it every week. & rarely are we wrong.
It is one of two things. The CC is lacking or the driver is lacking. (the pitcrew no matter what is definitely lacking) Now if you listen to his radio, I wouldnt be able to see how you couldnt conclude it is the CC that is lacking. At times he seems litterally clueless. This has been this way for three years. Also it wouldnt be exceptable if this was happening to Tony's team. All these things have proven facts attached to them. Funny thing is when we try to point out the logic behind our opinions, you turn & say a blanket statement in defense of tony or ownership. In my mind the only argument is to say it is the driver not the CC. Which would be an acceptable argument, just not one of my opinion.
So since you wont allow deductive reasoning, let me give you a fact that cant be argued.
"I" in all my years of listening to all these CCs, have never heard a more clueless CC, on such a consistent basis. I have heard a CC have a bad race, or make a pretty bad decision. I have heard drivers be completely clueless sounding on how to explain what is wrong with a car (Dale Jr. comes to mind) We all have heard drivers pretty much lose it on a radio, & become a hinderence to the team. But none of this I have ever seen or heard of or even talked to other people that listen to team radioes that were as bad as TG. With the exception of Mike Shiplett. Heard some pretty bad things about him on a concsistent basis from a fan of his driver.

Tonys team has a bad race & they wanted to hang DG. I would have loved to have him on the 39 team. Tony won 5 races & almost won (or was in contention) probably close to another 5 races.
We are Happy when Ryan has the chance to sniff the top 5.
So until Stewart haas changes either the driver or the CC we can & should blame ownership for allowing this team to flounder in mediocry. Tony said himself he wanted to have two championship caliber teams before starting aa 3rd team. Obviously his attention isnt on the 39 team.

I do blame ownership
What do you think about that SS14

thing is we are not allowed to question anything about tony, because he is so worshiped here, he doesnt make mistakes, the people around him make the mistakes, it was funny, last year no one hardly posted jack about ryan, except the usual people, heck its been like that since day one, but now many come here to observe and make sure we dont bad mouth tony, so in many ways the ryan fans are trying to be censored, we cant have thoughts, and if we do, we have to walk the line and be politically correct, well tuff cookies on that, we can question SHR and management anytime we want, we can question the CC anytime we want, just like everybody did last year in wanting to hang DG out to dry, because we all know tony doesnt make mistakes so it has to be DG fault, so in saying that its all TG's fault, not ryan's....

Ryan's win at Martinsville was pure luck, nothing to do with Gibson.

I and nobody ever said that Grubb was one of the worst ccs in the history of cup. I did however note how inconsistent they were and that something was missing. Clearly management saw that too and a change was made.

SHR feels that perhaps the issues with the 39 are not limited to Gibson I guess. I just feel it is easier to judge someone who out there working their #### off while we sit and watch them. Schmoopy mentioned Gordon. Gordon had Letarte for five seasons and part of 2005. This is Newman's fourth season with Gibson.

Venting about Gibson is healthy. But blaming everything on him is not. It's unfair and unrealistic.

I only blame two things on him. Poor decision making on the box, & an incapability to think for himself on the box. (which could come from lack of confidence)
Put him in the shop & obviously he understands the in & outs of a car. They often times come to the track with a fast car, until the 1st pit stop. That is why I say he might be an awesome car chief. Who knows.
You guys complained about DG, meanwhile Tony had some of the best cars on the track & was in contention more often than not for wins & leads.
Ryan's team is very consistent. We know what to expect from it every week. & rarely are we wrong.
It is one of two things. The CC is lacking or the driver is lacking. (the pitcrew no matter what is definitely lacking) Now if you listen to his radio, I wouldnt be able to see how you couldnt conclude it is the CC that is lacking. At times he seems litterally clueless. This has been this way for three years. Also it wouldnt be exceptable if this was happening to Tony's team. All these things have proven facts attached to them. Funny thing is when we try to point out the logic behind our opinions, you turn & say a blanket statement in defense of tony or ownership. In my mind the only argument is to say it is the driver not the CC. Which would be an acceptable argument, just not one of my opinion.
So since you wont allow deductive reasoning, let me give you a fact that cant be argued.
"I" in all my years of listening to all these CCs, have never heard a more clueless CC, on such a consistent basis. I have heard a CC have a bad race, or make a pretty bad decision. I have heard drivers be completely clueless sounding on how to explain what is wrong with a car (Dale Jr. comes to mind) We all have heard drivers pretty much lose it on a radio, & become a hinderence to the team. But none of this I have ever seen or heard of or even talked to other people that listen to team radioes that were as bad as TG. With the exception of Mike Shiplett. Heard some pretty bad things about him on a concsistent basis from a fan of his driver.

Tonys team has a bad race & they wanted to hang DG. I would have loved to have him on the 39 team. Tony won 5 races & almost won (or was in contention) probably close to another 5 races.
We are Happy when Ryan has the chance to sniff the top 5.
So until Stewart haas changes either the driver or the CC we can & should blame ownership for allowing this team to flounder in mediocry. Tony said himself he wanted to have two championship caliber teams before starting aa 3rd team. Obviously his attention isnt on the 39 team.

I do blame ownership
What do you think about that SS14

First off I don't have the luxury of listening to radio communications.

Everyone who is a fan of a driver not named Jimmie Johnson thinks that their crew chief isn't good enough. I am so glad that you mentioned Mike Shiplet, as he is far worse cc then Gibson from what the Dinger loves have told me. Gibson has shown that he can at least win with his driver (Loudon last year was amazing performance when he won the pole, lead 148 laps and beat his boss). I am not trying to defend Gibson, I don't think that highly of him either. But around here it is "when in doubt blame Tony Gibson".

For the record I liked and still like Grubb. He is a great crew chief. But something was missing with him and Tony. Sure they had an amazing chase but give Tony some credit. The dude drove his heart out and rose to the occasion and honestly made Grubb look really good. Him winning the championship last year was nothing short of a miracle. That is called being a great athlete.

If the team has a poor upper management. Then what the #### does a team like Earnhardt Ganassi have? Exactly. Ryan's team isn't as bad as you make it out to be. An outside fan told me he thinks Ryan is running the way he normally does. The 39 isn't championship caliber, I agree with you on that. But they are not mediocre. Points finishes of 9th, 15th and tying for ninth last year prove that. They are 7th to 10th place race team that can get a win every now and then. Some of you guys are just way too dramatic I swear.

Ryan's win at Martinsville was pure luck, nothing to do with Gibson.

I and nobody ever said that Grubb was one of the worst ccs in the history of cup. I did however note how inconsistent they were and that something was missing. Clearly management saw that too and a change was made.

SHR feels that perhaps the issues with the 39 are not limited to Gibson I guess. I just feel it is easier to judge someone who out there working their #### off while we sit and watch them. Schmoopy mentioned Gordon. Gordon had Letarte for five seasons and part of 2005. This is Newman's fourth season with Gibson.

Venting about Gibson is healthy. But blaming everything on him is not. It's unfair and unrealistic.

I only blame two things on him. Poor decision making on the box, & an incapability to think for himself on the box. (which could come from lack of confidence)
Put him in the shop & obviously he understands the in & outs of a car. They often times come to the track with a fast car, until the 1st pit stop. That is why I say he might be an awesome car chief. Who knows.
You guys complained about DG, meanwhile Tony had some of the best cars on the track & was in contention more often than not for wins & leads.
Ryan's team is very consistent. We know what to expect from it every week. & rarely are we wrong.
It is one of two things. The CC is lacking or the driver is lacking. (the pitcrew no matter what is definitely lacking) Now if you listen to his radio, I wouldnt be able to see how you couldnt conclude it is the CC that is lacking. At times he seems litterally clueless. This has been this way for three years. Also it wouldnt be exceptable if this was happening to Tony's team. All these things have proven facts attached to them. Funny thing is when we try to point out the logic behind our opinions, you turn & say a blanket statement in defense of tony or ownership. In my mind the only argument is to say it is the driver not the CC. Which would be an acceptable argument, just not one of my opinion.
So since you wont allow deductive reasoning, let me give you a fact that cant be argued.
"I" in all my years of listening to all these CCs, have never heard a more clueless CC, on such a consistent basis. I have heard a CC have a bad race, or make a pretty bad decision. I have heard drivers be completely clueless sounding on how to explain what is wrong with a car (Dale Jr. comes to mind) We all have heard drivers pretty much lose it on a radio, & become a hinderence to the team. But none of this I have ever seen or heard of or even talked to other people that listen to team radioes that were as bad as TG. With the exception of Mike Shiplett. Heard some pretty bad things about him on a concsistent basis from a fan of his driver.

Tonys team has a bad race & they wanted to hang DG. I would have loved to have him on the 39 team. Tony won 5 races & almost won (or was in contention) probably close to another 5 races.
We are Happy when Ryan has the chance to sniff the top 5.
So until Stewart haas changes either the driver or the CC we can & should blame ownership for allowing this team to flounder in mediocry. Tony said himself he wanted to have two championship caliber teams before starting aa 3rd team. Obviously his attention isnt on the 39 team.

I do blame ownership
What do you think about that SS14

First off I don't have the luxury of listening to radio communications.

Everyone who is a fan of a driver not named Jimmie Johnson thinks that their crew chief isn't good enough. I am so glad that you mentioned Mike Shiplet, as he is far worse cc then Gibson from what the Dinger loves have told me. Gibson has shown that he can at least win with his driver (Loudon last year was amazing performance when he won the pole, lead 148 laps and beat his boss). I am not trying to defend Gibson, I don't think that highly of him either. But around here it is "when in doubt blame Tony Gibson".

For the record I liked and still like Grubb. He is a great crew chief. But something was missing with him and Tony. Sure they had an amazing chase but give Tony some credit. The dude drove his heart out and rose to the occasion and honestly made Grubb look really good. Him winning the championship last year was nothing short of a miracle. That is called being a great athlete.

If the team has a poor upper management. Then what the #### does a team like Earnhardt Ganassi have? Exactly. Ryan's team isn't as bad as you make it out to be. An outside fan told me he thinks Ryan is running the way he normally does. The 39 isn't championship caliber, I agree with you on that. But they are not mediocre. Points finishes of 9th, 15th and tying for ninth last year prove that. They are 7th to 10th place race team that can get a win every now and then. Some of you guys are just way too dramatic I swear.

actually I could probably poke a hole in just about every point you just made, but we will just continue in circles. So I wont.
I brought up Shiplett because after I talked to some hardcore Dinger fans, I conceded, he probably was worse than Gibson. (which is why with Gibson I say one of the worst LOL) The guy made me feel bad for Dinger fans. Also makes me wonder if he had some tony fan saying how he exaggerated, how bad Shiplett was & some of the blame was on the dinger? (I just wonder a lil bit)
As far as EGR. Their problem is how bad they want JPM to succeed. He is never gonna be that good in a cup car. They will make a ton of changes to EGR trying to make him & his team better. That is one driver where I believe it to be the driver holding back the team, rather than the other way around. He made the chase only one year, & that was the year where they made him driver like they wanted him to drive & be calmer with the car. So he didnt wreck & could get some consistent points. The next year he went back to driving like a hardheaded bonehead & now he never sniffs the Chase. So you ask about McMurray. JPM I believe affects McMurrays team as well, from all the changes they make to EGR trying to JPM up there. He is the big name with a racing pedigree. EGR hangs their hat on JPM, just like SHR hangs their hat on Tony. Only difference is Tony is one of the best cup drivers out there & JPM is still here because of his name only. If they swapped JPM & Ryan. McMurray would do better. the 42 car would do better. JPM would be the same. So if you are a McMurray fan, you really should hope they get rid of Juan someday. Target is on the car because of Ganassi. The driver doesnt matter. Ganassi could bring in whoever & keep Target as their sponsor. McMurray could outdrive Juan anyday IMO. I think EGR is focused on the wrong driver.
(figured I would comment on the none 39 team stuff with you to break the circle LOL)
I already know all your answers about the 39 team
your bottom line answer in short of the 39 team...... "Its not that bad!"
yet if the same thing was happening to the 14 team someone would have to give you oxygen.
Theres a word for that............ what is that?

actually I could probably poke a hole in just about every point you just made, but we will just continue in circles. So I wont.
I brought up Shiplett because after I talked to some hardcore Dinger fans, I conceded, he probably was worse than Gibson. (which is why with Gibson I say one of the worst LOL) The guy made me feel bad for Dinger fans. Also makes me wonder if he had some tony fan saying how he exaggerated, how bad Shiplett was & some of the blame was on the dinger? (I just wonder a lil bit)
As far as EGR. Their problem is how bad they want JPM to succeed. He is never gonna be that good in a cup car. They will make a ton of changes to EGR trying to make him & his team better. That is one driver where I believe it to be the driver holding back the team, rather than the other way around. He made the chase only one year, & that was the year where they made him driver like they wanted him to drive & be calmer with the car. So he didnt wreck & could get some consistent points. The next year he went back to driving like a hardheaded bonehead & now he never sniffs the Chase. So you ask about McMurray. JPM I believe affects McMurrays team as well, from all the changes they make to EGR trying to JPM up there. He is the big name with a racing pedigree. EGR hangs their hat on JPM, just like SHR hangs their hat on Tony. Only difference is Tony is one of the best cup drivers out there & JPM is still here because of his name only. If they swapped JPM & Ryan. McMurray would do better. the 42 car would do better. JPM would be the same. So if you are a McMurray fan, you really should hope they get rid of Juan someday. Target is on the car because of Ganassi. The driver doesnt matter. Ganassi could bring in whoever & keep Target as their sponsor. McMurray could outdrive Juan anyday IMO. I think EGR is focused on the wrong driver.
(figured I would comment on the none 39 team stuff with you to break the circle LOL)
I already know all your answers about the 39 team
your bottom line answer in short of the 39 team...... "Its not that bad!"
yet if the same thing was happening to the 14 team someone would have to give you oxygen.
Theres a word for that............ what is that?

Look, I am not saying that Gibson is good. I am not even saying that he shouldn't be replaced effective immediately. But considering how they have performed over a lot of other teams the past three seasons they could be worse off. That is all I am saying. He isn't running mid pack every week (though his performance as of late has been bad). He is running better then he did his latter years at Penske. I get your frustration over Gibson. I really do. I am just trying to offer some perspective. If Ryan was finishing 16th to 20 something in points, then I would be right with you. But he always seems to hang in there. Gibson could actually be a good cc, but he is far too inconsistent. But the fact that Ryan has never finished outside the top 15 in points with him shows that even someone who is mediocre has can deliver. When Shiplet was Dinger's cc the best they could do was finish 19th in points. See.

I agree with your EGR comments. While Jamie did get some changes to his team (new car chief), JPM got a whole entire team. Chip loves Jamie, but he just loves Juan twice as much (Open wheel guys stick together that is why Dinger is in the 22 imo).

JPM has the talent to win in Cup and contend for championships. He just doesn't have the mentality to race in Cup. Also whatever series he has ran, he may do good for a season or too, but always flizzed out then moved on to another series. The NASCAR lifestyle is too comfy for him to leave an easy $6 million a year to run midpack.

I don't want to say that all of Jamie's and the 1 team's problems, but yes I do agree that they are focusing on the wrong driver. Back from 2003 to 2005 when Jamie was in the 42 before he went to Roush, it was Jamie, Sterling Marlin and Casey Mears. Marlin had just came back from an injury and Mears is well Mears. McMurray was top dog there and beat Biffle for rookie of the year and never finished worse then 13th in points. I fully agree that McMurray could out drive Montoya any day. Kasey Kahne said it best "even in 2010 when their cars were good and McMurray was the man, Montoya still couldn't do anything."

If Tony's team was performing like Ryan team, I would be disappointed to an extent but mainly since he came off of a championship season. But remember Ryan has a win and is still in the chase hence 'it's not that bad". Like I said it just seems that the status quo here is "when in doubt blame Tony Gibson." In reality it's unfair to blame one person. Jeff Gordon is 24th in points and I honestly don't see him making the chase or winning this season. A little more perspective.